Tito's Partisan-Fascist Alliance

Picard

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Kingdom of Yugoslavia was an artificial creation resulting from Serb occupation of southern areas of Austria-Hungary. Croatian parts of Austria-Hungary were mostly given to Serbia, and in smaller part to Italy and Hungary.

Serb imperialists led by Nikola Pašić had already in 1916. accepted the “right” of Italy to Croatian coast, as long as Serbia itself gained access to Adriatic Sea. This was based on the London Agreement in 1915. where Britain gave Italy Croatian coast in order to entice it into joining the Entente. At the end of the war in 1918. Italy gained parts of the Croatian coast, but nowhere as much as it had wanted or been promised.
 

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From the very start, Italians were acting as enemies of the Croatian people in spite of the supposed alliance. Only 18 days after the capitulation of Yugoslavia, between 6th and 8th May, rebel Serbs from villages of Kijevo and Tramošanj raised what they called the “Đurđevdan Uprising”. Serbs opened fire against the Ustashi officials near Sanski Most, and soon the Serbs from nearby villages also joined the fight. Ustashi received reinforcements from Prijedor, and on 7th May one German detachment from 1st Battalion of the 132nd Regiment stationed in Prijedor also joined the fighting.

In Venetia on 15th May 1941., Croatia signed an agreement on joining the Tripartite Pact. In May 1941. Pavelić met Hitler in Bavaria, where Hitler suggested him to lead “fifty years of ethnically intolerant policy”. Following this, in the next few months the Ustashi government deported several tens of thousands of Serbs to Serbia, and additional 120 000 in the next two years.
 

Varoon2

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^^
Okay, but nothing of what you described, remotely matches the horrors inflicted on the Serbs by the Croation Ustashi. The Serbs are not saints, but they didn't deserve 300,000 people slaughtered( many after gruesome torture) and another 300,000 or more forcibly converted to the Croat sect of Christianity, with yet hundred few hundred thousand expelled from the land.
 

Picard

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^^
Okay, but nothing of what you described, remotely matches the horrors inflicted on the Serbs by the Croation Ustashi. The Serbs are not saints, but they didn't deserve 300,000 people slaughtered( many after gruesome torture) and another 300,000 or more forcibly converted to the Croat sect of Christianity, with yet hundred few hundred thousand expelled from the land.
None of that happened. Like, ever.

I did some calculations in the article, which you clearly have not read:

Italians were doing everything possible to inflame the war in Yugoslavia. Aside from using the weapons deliveries for this, they also used the media. Italian daily from Bologne, Il resto del Carlino, published in period of 18th to 22nd of October 1941 – the worst period of fascism – articles by Corrada Zolli in which this journalist pretended to be “shocked” by the Ustashi crimes. With such articles the Italians were trying to foster hate against Croatia among Serbs and Italians, and so Croatian crimes – while not nonexistent – were largely exaggerated and made up. Good example of this exaggeration were the reports about hundreds of thousands of people murdered in Jasenovac and other camps – between 250 000 and 700 000 just Serbs in NDH by 1943., as reported by Germans. But basic arithmetic can show why this number is false. If some 250 000 and 700 000 Serbs had been murdered by 1943, this means that by the end of the war the number will have grown to 500 000 to 1,4 million. And this is just Serbs.

In reality, combined number of victims of war in entirety of Yugoslavia from 1941 to 1945, not counting the post-war murders by Communists, is around 700 000 – and this includes Serbs, Croats, Germans, Italians and so on, people killed by the Ustashi, Germans, Italians but also by Chetniks, Partisans, Soviets, and Allied bombardments. With NDH having 42% of the prewar population of Yugoslavia, even with murder rate being twice the remaining Yugoslavia there could have been no more than 450 000 dead in NDH. Depending on total casualties in Yugoslavia – which are between 500 000 at minimum and 1 million at maximum, this number could go as low as 200 000 or as high as 700 000. According to Žerjavić, in Croatia and BiH Partisans had killed 101 000 Croats and Muslims, and Chetniks further 68 000. Partisans themselves had killed some 10 000 Serbs just in 1945., mostly Chetniks; thus 20 000 – 40 000 total Serbs killed by Partisans is not impossible, of which 10 000 – 30 000 may have been in NDH.

This means that Axis in total will have been responsible for 266 000 dead in the NDH in the median figure (that is, 266 000 out of 450 000 dead in total), with minimum being 21 000 and maximum 531 000. This number will have included both enemy combatants and the civilians. Significant number of the dead were Croats who had gone to Partisans in order to resist Italian occupation of Dalmatia (resistance which, by the way, was contrary to Tito’s desires, and many Croatian Partisans ended up being murdered on Tito’s orders). Therefore, ignoring the low-end figure which is completely unlikely, number of Serbs killed by the Axis (be it Germans, Italians or Croatians) in NDH cannot have been above 400 000 (assuming 531 000 dead in total), and more likely it will have been around 100 000 – 200 000. This number, as rough as it is, should clearly show that Italians were engaging in a clear campaign of defamation and psychological propaganda warfare against Croatia.

(It should be noted that the above number of 100 000 – 200 000 Serbs killed includes only those killed by the Axis – it completely ignores those killed by the Partisans or other causes. However, it includes all Serbs killed by the Axis and all causes – which is to say, it includes people killed in combat and in concentration camps, killed by Croatians, Germans or Italians).
As for forcible conversions - not only were there no formal transfers of Orthodox believers into the Catholic church - but there were not even transfers into Graeco-Catholic Church. If there were forcible conversions, they were not done en masse.

I mean, Serbs believe that Croats are literally Catholic Serbs. Sapienti sat.
 

Varoon2

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Thanks , your message does show, that Serbs themselves were not guilty of any mass killing. They were much more victims, whether by Nazis, Communists, Ustashi or Allied bombardments.

But the fact remains that a large number of Serbs to this day, feel they were savagely victimised by the Croatian Ustashi. And those Serbs do know that many of them were also killed by German Nazis et al

There must be some deep seated animosity for these beliefs to be held for so long.
 
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Picard

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In the early 1942., before the expected Italian occupation of the areas under Chetnik control in eastern Bosnia, major Boško Todović sent a directive to his officers on 9.1.1942. in which he explained the strategy of legalization as follows: “Situation is such that at any moment the German – Italian invasion of our liberated part of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia can begin, and force relations do not allow hope for successful resistance. In such a situation, and resistance would be extremely harmful for the Serbian population in this area, and also useless. Because of these factors, we will carry out timely strategic retreat with one part of our forces, while the second part will pose as Serbian Voluntary Chetnik Detachments and remain with the populace for its protection, even if forced to cooperate with the occupational forces similar to how sanitary organs, municipal governments and police do during the evacuation of territory. Partisan elders will be warned not to create unnecessary casualties among the Serb populace…”. In the public announcements, Orthodox priest Đujić pronounced to Serbs: “Dear brothers, do not be deceived by the Ustashi provocateurs and the irresponsible adventuristic elements which are inciting you to a battle against the Italian armed force… we have concluded a permanent peace.”.

Thanks , your message does show, that Serbs themselves were not guilty of any mass killing. They were much more victims, whether by Nazis, Communists, Ustashi or Allied bombardments.

But the fact remains that a large number of Serbs to this day, feel they were savagely victimised by the Croatian Ustashi. And those Serbs do know that many of them were also killed by German Nazis et al

There must be some deep seated animosity for these beliefs to be held for so long.
And that is wrong. They were victims, yes, but that doesn't mean they were innocent. They were perpetators as well.

Serbs were guilty of mass killings - many of them, in fact. And these mass killings began even before the war. In fact, one of major reasons why Ustashi movement was formed in the first place is because Chetnik paramilitary formations were killing and terrorizing Croatians and the government of Kingdom of Yugoslavia just turned a blind eye to it. Does it excuse what the Ustashi did? No. But Serbs were not innocent victims.

World War 2, especially in Yugoslavia, is far more complex than the childish black-and-white, good versus evil view that is so often promoted and that you seem to have accepted. But belief on both sides that they were exclusive victims is precisely what has helped maintain the circle of violence. Even today, Serbs celebrate Chetnik and Communist mass murderers.

In fact, uprising in Srb had been prepared even before establishment of the Independent State of Croatia. Serb deserters from Yugoslav army – who later became Chetniks – came to Srb in April 1941., bringing with them enough weapons and ammunition to arm a reinforced company of 136 men at least. They were soon joined by the Communists “from all parts”, who in early June formed their “revolutionary councils” and started moving people to forests. Ustashi only came to Srb around 20th of June, which means that Ustashi crimes could not have caused the uprising. In fact, Serbs in all parts of NDH had been armed, mostly with weapons taken from the dissolving Royal Yugoslav Army. This led to significant Chetnik activity almost immediately, and Ustashi attempts at disarming the rebels led to armed clashes.



 

Varoon2

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In the early 1942., before the expected Italian occupation of the areas under Chetnik control in eastern Bosnia, major Boško Todović sent a directive to his officers on 9.1.1942. in which he explained the strategy of legalization as follows: “Situation is such that at any moment the German – Italian invasion of our liberated part of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia can begin, and force relations do not allow hope for successful resistance. In such a situation, and resistance would be extremely harmful for the Serbian population in this area, and also useless. Because of these factors, we will carry out timely strategic retreat with one part of our forces, while the second part will pose as Serbian Voluntary Chetnik Detachments and remain with the populace for its protection, even if forced to cooperate with the occupational forces similar to how sanitary organs, municipal governments and police do during the evacuation of territory. Partisan elders will be warned not to create unnecessary casualties among the Serb populace…”. In the public announcements, Orthodox priest Đujić pronounced to Serbs: “Dear brothers, do not be deceived by the Ustashi provocateurs and the irresponsible adventuristic elements which are inciting you to a battle against the Italian armed force… we have concluded a permanent peace.”.



And that is wrong. They were victims, yes, but that doesn't mean they were innocent. They were perpetators as well.

Serbs were guilty of mass killings - many of them, in fact. And these mass killings began even before the war. In fact, one of major reasons why Ustashi movement was formed in the first place is because Chetnik paramilitary formations were killing and terrorizing Croatians and the government of Kingdom of Yugoslavia just turned a blind eye to it. Does it excuse what the Ustashi did? No. But Serbs were not innocent victims.

World War 2, especially in Yugoslavia, is far more complex than the childish black-and-white, good versus evil view that is so often promoted and that you seem to have accepted. But belief on both sides that they were exclusive victims is precisely what has helped maintain the circle of violence. Even today, Serbs celebrate Chetnik and Communist mass murderers.






Is there a book you can recommend that covers this tragic, brutal period? One that is very readable! There is a novel about the ultra fascist phase in Hungary in late1944, early 1945, when the Arrow Cross was running things. It has the word " Garden" in it. Unreadable, dreary, not captivating. Whereas someone like Martin Gilbert( though it is non fiction about WW2) is an excellent writer.
 

Picard

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Is there a book you can recommend that covers this tragic, brutal period? One that is very readable! There is a novel about the ultra fascist phase in Hungary in late1944, early 1945, when the Arrow Cross was running things. It has the word " Garden" in it. Unreadable, dreary, not captivating. Whereas someone like Martin Gilbert( though it is non fiction about WW2) is an excellent writer.
Unfortunately, most of the stuff I read is unreadable and dreary - academic documents tend to be like that. Not many books though, as Communists still hold near-monopoly on publishing.

When it comes to non-Communist publishers, Verbum is a good choice:

But I am not sure they publish many, if any, books in English.
 

Varoon2

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I suppose there isn't a movie about those times either! Not as far as war era Yugoslavia goes, and certainly not in English or from Hollywood. May I recommend an excellent, stirring movie called "Music Box", with the American actress Jessica Lange. One of my top 10 best movies of all time. It deals with an American citizen of Hungarian background in contemporary times( film came out in 1989) being charged with war atrocities in Hungary in late 1944 and early 1945, while he was allegedly serving as a leader of the Hungarian fascist Arrow Cross.

The courtroom scenes are more gripping and suspenseful than anything you will see in actual law and order TV shows or movies. Victims and witnesses to the Arrow Cross slaughters are cross questioned about their identification of the Hungarian American Lazlow as the actual killer Mishka from the 1940s. Jessica Lange plays the daughter of the accused, and lawyer tasked with defending him. She tries to discredit the victims by bringing up their supposed Communist affiliations.

There are twists and turns, smokescreens and false leads until...well I won't reveal the climax. Definitely worth watching. And not far removed from our topic, considering Hungary is pretty close to Yugoslavia.
 

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