AMCA - Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (HAL)

[Satish Sharma]

Unfortunately shiv aroor in his podcast had said IAF is in touch with development & can demand changes as it progresses

 

[Super Flanker]

does AMCA have true EOTS instead of that IRST Bulb which degrades entire plane stealth?

On the debate of EOTS vs IRST on AMCA: The main complaint I see from many is that the conventional IRST design will cause a greater RCS return in comparison to a EOTS whose shape is tailored made to reflect as little radar return as possible. In short: "basically the EOTS design is stealthy whereas the conventional IRST design such as the OLS-30 on the Flanker fleet isn't."

Few years back, it was revealed that DRDO's IRDE was working on an EOTS for the AMCA, and if memory serves me right, they have achieved a good amount of progress and the sensor system was already tested on a test bed, and this was all revealed back in 2022. So a bit more than two years have already passed. In these two years, DRDO has definitely achieved a substantial amount of success in the sensor's development.

Let's take a look at the Su-57 right now. Here is the Su-57 with the 101KS-V IRST.

The Su-57 is the only 5th generation aircraft among the F-22, F-35, and J-20 to use a conventional IRST, it is placed on the same exact spot on the Su-57 where the OLS-30 is fitted on the Su-30MKI. The IRST on the Su-57 has received extensive RCS treatment, the same can be expected on an IRST for the AMCA, of course this is assuming it will get one in the first place.

Looking at the current situation, the first flight of AMCA will be possible only after 2025/2026. And the AMCA will enter serial production and consequently be inducted into the IAF only beyond 2030, there are still many years to go. I am sure by 2030, DRDO's IRDE will manage to develop an EOTS similar in capabilities to the AAQ-40 EOTS on the F-35 and the the EOTS-89/86 on the J-20.

For now many of us, deep down inside with pessimism may be convinced that the AMCA will field a conventional IRST design, but even if it was done, the IRST of the AMCA won't reduce the stealth properties of the AMCA to the point that it will effect it's mission profile where stealth will be a priority because: An IRST if fielded on the AMCA will receive extensive RCS treatment to mitigate RCS return, be it applying of advanced RAM, or designing the interior components within the IRST's sphere to reflect radar waves away from the source.

But it's more likely that an EOTS will be fielded, why? Because the first AMCA will enter service only beyond 2030, DRDO's IRDE has already achieved substantial progress on the development of an indigenous EOTS, I am sure that by 2030, or even before that, the EOTS will be fully ready for the AMCA. Just think about it. Besides you never know how DRDO, IAF, HAL, ADA and everyone else might surprise us the last minute.

So I just want to advise the folks on this thread, just relax, Chill, and think positive, being pessimistic all the time ain't gonna do any good. Take a break for a few minutes, refresh yourself and come back to the thread.

 

[Satish Sharma]

 

[Mr.Evil007]

I can already read the comments even before clicking on it lol

 

[kamaal]

Nothing new, just the man compares AMCA with Turkish Kaan program because of the approach. Calls kf21 not a proper 5th gen jet.

In addition, Defense matrix channel called Kaan just a PR while Kf21 as progress and real project. Ironically AMCA is neither of them.

 

[Mr.Evil007]

Nothing new, just the man compares AMCA with Turkish Kaan program because of the approach. Calls kf21 not a proper 5th gen jet.

In addition, Defense matrix channel called Kaan just a PR while Kf21 as progress and real project. Ironically AMCA is neither of them.

Sometimes I think defence matrix is just taking a piss lmao he is poking Turks so much over kaan

 

[mamamia12]

Sometimes I think defence matrix is just taking a piss lmao he is poking Turks so much over kaan

If that KAAN had designed with F-414 engines in mind, and had its flight with that, then I would shut my mouth. Because even in case of USA denying Engines, I bet its easier to come up with F-414 class engines than F-110 Class engines, but stupid retarded turks had to resort to dick measuring contest with F-22 and design a bloated plane that gonna be too underpowered unless its slapped with F-110 or more thrust engines. In fact, I rather has to give AMCA Program Planners, a clap that they went with a more realistic thrust class engines i.e F-414 rather than some F-110 or AL-31/41. Now, erdoggy gonna get rekt because Jet engine technology is not like Millions of rebadged reverse engineered stuff the Turkish fanboys jerk off to. Their program is held by balls by Americans until their domestic engine is realized. I genuinely gets amused by these Turkish Fanboys who seem to think just because their 6000 lbs thrust class engine worked out, they can get a 35,000 lbs engine easily. Heck, it took Chinese some billions of money with chinese money and chinese "brain" to get there. Moreover if you look at turkish MIC stuff, most of them move rarely to production. Mass producing Engines is as complex as developing one.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Hehe

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

Hehe

Anyone who thought otherwise was a grade 1 moron lmao

 

[mamamia12]

Anyone who thought otherwise was a grade 1 moron lmao

HAL's thing is along with GTRE absorb that technology not this IPR export jhumla. I feel it audacious for HAL to even think about exports? I mean what kind of delusion are they being in to even think about exports?

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

HAL's thing is along with GTRE absorb that technology not this IPR export jhumla. I feel it audacious for HAL to even think about exports? I mean what kind of delusion are they being in to even think about exports?

They are thinking of exporting mk2 to Philippines and other US friendly countries but they stay dreams for now their is a reason why GOV is going a ahead with Kaveri now

 

[Mr.Evil007]

They are thinking of exporting mk2 to Philippines and other US friendly countries but they stay dreams for now their is a reason why GOV is going a ahead with Kaveri now

What’s the timeline for Kaveri?

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

What’s the timeline for Kaveri?

If funds flow on time somewhere in mid 2030s if they don't then never depends on how Gov takes this forward

 

[Arjun Mk1A]

Hehe

Hot core tech will never going to be shared with Us. Even the Rafale Offset ends up with Snecma asking us to use their Hot core.

GTRE and HAL taking mango man for the ride.


Only Kaveri with improved Alloys can solve the issue.

 

[mokoman]

Hehe

not that bad ? , we cant export without their approval , i mean its their tech after all .

doesnt say how much screwdrivergiri will be involved or how much of it will be build here . anyone know ?

 

[sameer3694]

What’s the timeline for Kaveri?

First the immediate goal is dry kaveri variant needs to be inducted with Ghatak. Only then we can think of a timeline.

 

[BON PLAN]

just the man compares AMCA with Turkish Kaan program because of the approach. Calls kf21 not a proper 5th gen jet.

The skill of south Koreans is incomparable to Turkishs ones. I see a technical better futur for KF21 than KAAN.
The increment evolution is the right way.

 

[BON PLAN]

Hehe

Nothing surprising.
The US congress will never agree such technology deal.
Remain russia, but their tech is older and older.
Remain GB, but their last 100% english engine is old (Spey, no?)
Remain France.

 

[BON PLAN]

Only Kaveri with improved Alloys can solve the issue.

It's not only an alloy problem. The actual kaveri runs, but only in dry mode, so nothing to do with alloy.

I have the possibility to spoke with the father of M88, Andre Barbot, as I was invited to his son marriage. It was 30 years ago, more or less.
He said me that it is a question of "sorcery" as only a couple of men in the world have the enough skill and experience to assemble the differents components of an engine in harmony. Even a very skilled company as SAFRAN experience troubles (see Silvercrest failure).

See how it was long and difficult to the chinese just to copy and paste russian engines !
In the Indian case you lack proper wizards, with enough skill and experience. It will come, with time, money, failures and prototypes.
Kaveri was simply too optimistic for its time.

 

[mamamia12]

It's not only an alloy problem. The actual kaveri runs, but only in dry mode, so nothing to do with alloy.

I have the possibility to spoke with the father of M88, Andre Barbot, as I was invited to his son marriage. It was 30 years ago, more or less.
He said me that it is a question of "sorcery" as only a couple of men in the world have the enough skill and experience to assemble the differents components of an engine in harmony. Even a very skilled company as SAFRAN experience troubles (see Silvercrest failure).

See how it was long and difficult to the chinese just to copy and paste russian engines !
In the Indian case you lack proper wizards, with enough skill and experience. It will come, with time, money, failures and prototypes.
Kaveri was simply too optimistic for its time.

How realistic is turkey 35,000lbs engine for their KAAN which they boast of by 2028? Even the most pessimistic of them seem to think around timeline of 2035.