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Well, there you go.
Well, there you go.
So the base armor without the add on NERA modules is basically shit tier, as expected. Oh and thanks for the upload, bruv.A recent document regarding Thai army testing of VT4 and T-80 (oplot) was leaked. From there you can estimate the level of performance to be expected of VT-4.
View attachment 46012View attachment 46012
Well, at least the turret doesn't have any obvious weak spots (even though the base armor itself is rather thin by today's standards), wish could say the same about our Arjun.VT-4 MBT is mainly for the export market developed by Norinco. Earlier it was called MBT3000. It has a real chance to end up in the neighbourhood of India with potential customers being Pakistan, Bangladesh and China.The performance of VT-4 MBT if compared to Indian standards, is between T-72 CIA and T-90S Bhisma. It is inferior to Type -99M in all aspects. The base armour is thin compared to Type 99 and it sports similar wedge shaped era blocks on the turret front and has side protection from ERA.
Ex-Army jernails who keep complaining about lack of political-will can't think beyond military tactics, military tactics is part of the solution not the entire solution. The fact some of these chaps are complaining means they are not on need to know basis.Which rock did you come out of?
Army blames the political leadership because without orders the Army cannot even point a gun at Pakistan. Surgical Strikes, Balakot, Artillery Strikes all options existed for years but could be done only when the govt. ordered.
Blame the govt. - they are the ones who are not letting the Army hit Pakistan
You are confusing TV debate with a proper debate.You mean "Saboot Lao" and "Gali Ka Gunda" type of debate ???
You conduct any debate and our politics will pull it down to their level.
When you do not understand a thing then confuse, create chaos, change the subject, take discussion somewhere else, falsehood, bring it down to personal attacks, outshout the other, muffle the voice of the other,,,etc are age-old, well tested and regular tactics used by Indian politicians and their paid spokesperson.
How can a healthy debate be conducted when someone deliberately calls a Major Generals as Major Sahba such in TV debate......
Which proper debate. You mean the likes of JNU, Jadavpur University, or the ones at JLF where some leftist Catarinas are amassed outside to shout slogans.You are confusing TV debate with a proper debate.
Are they supposed to or mandated to go beyond. Does an environment exist for them to go beyond matters military?Ex-Army jernails who keep complaining about lack of political-will can't think beyond military tactics
Oh, did they ever fail in that sphere? Why put the blame where it is not due.military tactics is part of the solution not the entire solution. The fact some of these chaps are complaining means they are not on need to know basis.
Who is responsible to look at the problem in its entirety? Only those who are in know of complete things. Are the brass part of CCS, CCPA, Finance ministry, MoD, MHA, MEA, NIA, NSS etc ? Then how would they be in complete know of things.i don't think if they think of the problem statement in it's entirety, they will be complaining about things like political will.
Your conclusion is not well-founded and lacks from informational deficiencies.saying so because i haven't once heard a discussion where pak problem is discussed in it's entirety. it's always bits and pieces but never all at once. by "all" i mean diplomatic, strategic, military, economic & political terms.
i am not going into point by point reply.Are they supposed to or mandated to go beyond. Does an environment exist for them to go beyond matters military?
Look at your neighbourhood and you would know that when they all controlling the affairs they can make you dance like a mad dogs.
Your entire politicians and Babu establishment dances to the tunes of Pakistan, Naples, Bhutanese, Bangladeshi, Myanmar and PLA Generals. Indian generals can be a little better I assure you.
Oh, did they ever fail in that sphere? Why put the blame where it is not due.
Who is responsible to look at the problem in its entirety? Only those who are in know of complete things. Are the brass part of CCS, CCPA, Finance ministry, MoD, MHA, MEA, NIA, NSS etc ? Then how would they be in complete know of things.
Is Genral Bajwa in complete know of things ? That is the answer....
Your conclusion is not well-founded and lacks from informational deficiencies.
Anyone knows the status of these Quad Tube NVG which Tonbo showcased at Defence Expo 2020, is the SF, NSG conducting it's trials??1000 Quad NVGs can be bought for a price of 1 T 90 remember that.
This ain't no Gucci gear, this is a necessity.
Indian Amry won't conduct tests until desi NVGs can look under Imran Begum's Slawar from LOC.Anyone knows the status of these Quad Tube NVG which Tonbo showcased at Defence Expo 2020, is the SF, NSG conducting it's trials??
How do you know that sniper is good ? Have you fired it yourself ? What tests has it passed till now ? Do you know how well it does in different wheather conditions ? Or is it that it looks good and fancy so it must be good ?They won't Induct SSS sniper until it can blow up Mars or at least moon.
I don't know if it is good but I don't know if its bad either. How can we even say that OFB rifles are good until tests are carried out.How do you know that sniper is good ? Have you fired it yourself ? What tests has it passed till now ? Do you know how well it does in different wheather conditions ? Or is it that it looks good and fancy so it must be good ?
The Russians have realised how important foot soilders are.Indian Amry won't conduct tests until desi NVGs can look under Imran Begum's Slawar from LOC.
They won't Induct SSS sniper until it can blow up Mars or at least moon.
Foot soldiers bhad me jaye genrail ji ka Daru Sutta chalta rahna chaiye.
Wonder why Russian Procurement don't take this much time.
Georgian war exposed the cold war relic doctrine.The Russians have realised how important foot soilders are.
Their army is nowhere comparable in strength to their Soviet Era days.
They had such a large army back in the Cold War that they couldn't care less about foot soilders.
The Russians now give more importance to quality rather than quantity.
Absolutely. The entire top brass is full of Corrupts. After all we are Indians. Corruption is our birth right after grabbing power. Its shame that having COmpanies like Tonbo @ our doorsteps, our Soldiers are operating without 'sufficient NVGs and thermal Imagers. SSS sniper trial hasn't been started yet. Even it starts,they will constantly harass them by changing requirements constantly. They will ultimately reject them and buy phoren snipers. Atags, Guided Pinaka trials going on since ages..They are planning to order Athos from Israel despite Atags getting success in trials. The MoD babus knows jackshit about defense. They cant even differentiate between Tejas & JF 17. They take decisions by feedback of Army. So its not that only they are responsible for shabby procurements. Conduct never ending trials, change requirements, ultimately reject them and go for phoren option. This is playing years after years. No one to question them. Even someone raises legitimate questions they are told Ohh you know better than Army whats good for them, you are keyboard warrior and what not.Indian Amry won't conduct tests until desi NVGs can look under Imran Begum's Slawar from LOC.
They won't Induct SSS sniper until it can blow up Mars or at least moon.
Foot soldiers bhad me jaye genrail ji ka Daru Sutta chalta rahna chaiye.
Wonder why Russian Procurement don't take this much time.
Maybe they will conduct trials after getting initial kickback, and order them after getting rest of the amount. Not sure.Anyone knows the status of these Quad Tube NVG which Tonbo showcased at Defence Expo 2020, is the SF, NSG conducting it's trials??
PMO office and cabinet decides the Mood of armed forces.Absolutely. The entire top brass is full of Corrupts. After all we are Indians. Corruption is our birth right after grabbing power. Its shame that having COmpanies like Tonbo @ our doorsteps, our Soldiers are operating without 'sufficient NVGs and thermal Imagers. SSS sniper trial hasn't been started yet. Even it starts,they will constantly harass them by changing requirements constantly. They will ultimately reject them and buy phoren snipers. Atags, Guided Pinaka trials going on since ages..They are planning to order Athos from Israel despite Atags getting success in trials. The MoD babus knows jackshit about defense. They cant even differentiate between Tejas & JF 17. They take decisions by feedback of Army. So its not that only they are responsible for shabby procurements. Conduct never ending trials, change requirements, ultimately reject them and go for phoren option. This is playing years after years. No one to question them. Even someone raises legitimate questions they are told Ohh you know better than Army whats good for them, you are keyboard warrior and what not.